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< The Common Room ~ Fanon that makes you cringe and cry |
| bellasol67 |
 Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 1:12 pm |
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Joined: 14 Oct 2005
Posts: 6
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1. A/N throughout the story...I'll just stop reading right then.
2. Slang-type words ('dude' for one), I don't see much of this w/ SS/HG, mostly in Draco/Ginny pairings...drives me nuts.
3. Crying Snape. I have only seen it done well once (SnarkyRoxy's Before the Dawn). Both Canon & Movie Snape don't look like they are going to cry at the drop of a hat or when Hermione leaves them because they were being an ass.
Please don't flame me...I think part of the fun of fan fiction is to take the characters we love and manipulate them to our imagination (if that means Hermione takes Snape to Disney and makes him get on the 'It's a Small World' ride, so be it)...whether or not I want to read that, is up to me. |
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| Sevvy |
| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 3:46 am |
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Joined: 18 Aug 2005
Posts: 3
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Let's see...
~The student-teacher thing...at least they have to have SOME reservations about it. Lust isn't going to collapse Snape's character, for example. He'll still say that it's inappropriate. NEVER, ever, ever, would the Snape I know (I love his character) have more than a one-night stand with a student unless under very, very specific and freeing circumstances. He holds his views.~
~Mary Sues and Anti-Sues. OK, nobody's perfect, and everybody has at LEAST one talent, got that? There is no perfection nor is there somebody without talents. We all have some decency at something.~
~The 'soft' Snape. Now, he might be a miserable guy, but Snape isn't a softy. That's Dumbledore's job. Snape does NOT cry at all from anything canon. He is strong and I dislike people making him all soft and mushy. Come on, where's the fun in that?~
~Torturous, abusive parents for anybody but Harry, and that's not his real parents. Most of the 'Golden Trio' have good upbringings. Even at the nastiest times, Harry's isn't all that bad. He has a home, food, and they aren't too abusive. Dudley's a bastard, but hey, we all know a bastard or two!~
~Anything that is the exact opposite of canon. Although, certain canon facts can be disregarded, such as HBP canon, but please no opposites.~
~Evil bastard Snape. Sure, he's a jerk and a bit of an ass sometimes, but bloody hell, he's not evil. He doesn't do anything to confirm his evilness, not even at the end of HBP.~
That's about it. Oh, I abhore manipulative Dumbledore. By the way, about the godfather thing, I have a godfather and my parents and me are pagan. It's more of a safety net, just in case. |
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| liquidscissors |
| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 11:51 am |
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Joined: 27 Dec 2004
Posts: 164
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I can appreciate the deliciousness of someone called 'Sevvy' posting in a thread about bad fanon items, can you?
(Not being mean, ducks, just that it makes me laugh.) |
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| tiddlywinks |
| Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:27 pm |
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Joined: 26 Oct 2005
Posts: 2
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As far as the 'student-teacher reservation' thing goes, I'd rather have no reservations at all than the classic slot-in complaint that goes like: "but I'm your teacher! This is wro... oh let's just have sex". If there is going to be issues about it I think you can manage more than one sentence.
As far as a lot of cliches go I can manage. It's like watching a romance movie - you know what's going to happen but it's ok. Nice!Snape or Super!Hermione will never end up in my favourites box, but I'll probably read it if I'm bored.
I can't stand repetitive grammar or spelling mistakes though. I'm outta there by the third "loose/lose" "quite/quiet" *shudder* |
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| madjh |
| Posted: Thu Nov 24, 2005 8:58 am |
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Joined: 23 Nov 2005
Posts: 4
Location: Rudderless, in the Black.
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*tip-toes in*
What a delicious topic! Let's see now...
~Head Boy and Head Girl with their own quarters, sharing quarters, etc. There is no canon evidence for it. In fact, the boys can't even enter the girls' dormitories!
~Dumbledore arranging for his students to shack up, with professors or each other. Honestly. He might be modern enough in his thinking to understand a little hanky-panky here and there, but he's not going to encourage underaged sex in his school!
~The Mauraders referring to themselves publicly by their nicknames. You know, I got the sense that the whole Marauder thing was really a private joke. They might not have even told Lily and she certainly wouldn't have called "Hey, Prongs!" across a crowded hall.
~Teen Sex!God Sirius. Yeah, I know a few teenaged guys who think they're that hot... but none of them really are.
~Sweet!Draco. He's a nasty git. If he's going to fall hopelessly in love with Ginny or Hermione, we're going to need to see some serious character growth and backstory.
~Bumbling Lucius/Bella/Voldemort. They are frightening villians in canon because they're intelligent. They aren't the foolish super villians in a campy sixties tv show.
~Next Generation fics where all the kids have canon names. IE Ginny and Harry name their dozen kids: Lily, James, Sirius, Arthur, Molly, Fred, Bill, etc. Especially when they start out with all of these brand new characters with former characters' names and they're all running around and... it gets very confusing. If I can't discern the characters pretty quickly, I'm not going to waste my time.
~'Mione. Ron uses that ONCE in canon... because his mouth was full of food!
~Scriptfics. If you're actually writing something that you could envision on stage, complete with stage directions and appropriately formatted... well, that might almost be tolerable... But, even professional scripts make for dull reading. Plays are meant to be seen, very few modern ones are all that accessible as stories in their own right. Mostly it appears to be a device for novice authors to avoid writing traditional dialogue and description.
~Songfics. There might be a few out there with legitimate purposes for being, but Kelly Clarkson and Usher do not put me in a Potterish mood.
/rantiness |
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| crazy_kat |
| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2005 4:39 am |
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Joined: 01 Dec 2005
Posts: 9
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I've been out of fanfic for a couple years, and recently became interested again.
Things that bother me now:
OMG WTF DUDE THATS SO KEWL! 13 year olds writing HG/SS fics. If you are just hitting puberty, please leave a 40-something year old man alone.
Spelling/Grammar mistakes everywhere - sure, I make mistakes. Everyone does. If the author is a non-native English speaker, I'll be more lenient. Still, there are plenty of people out there willing to look over your stories. USE THEM.
Cute Hermione/Sex-Queen Hermione - she is a nerd, let's face it. No amount of maturity or hormones will get her nose out of books.
Time-turner fics which involve Harry/Ron/Hermione going back to the first rise of Voldemort or earlier.
Snape as Harry's father. Just... no. |
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| slytherinheiress |
| Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 2:12 am |
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Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 11
Location: Middle of the Middle West, USA
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azazello wrote: 6. Fanfic references to Lucius having that cane. It's a movie prop. It tells me the writer has not read the books.
Okay, okay, I agree on the rest, but the cane is simply too good NOT to use. My books are dog-eared and highlighted with notes in the margins and I still can't give that bit up. Yes, I admit, I have a 'Jason Isaacs addiction' (although I really don't appreciate what he's done to Lucius), but when I picture MY Lucius, it's inevitably Mr. Isaacs, cane in hand. I can't help it.
I must say that the one other thing that drives me simply insane (although it may sound a bit snarky) is 'children' writing beyond their years. Yes, we all know you're dreaming of your first date/kiss/sexual experience, but you're not convincing those of us that have been there.
Kristin |
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| madjh |
| Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2005 5:49 pm |
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Joined: 23 Nov 2005
Posts: 4
Location: Rudderless, in the Black.
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crazy_kat wrote: Things that bother me now:
OMG WTF DUDE THATS SO KEWL! 13 year olds writing HG/SS fics. If you are just hitting puberty, please leave a 40-something year old man alone.
...
*laughs*
*attempts to catch breath*
Yeah, the younguns attempting to write about an adult's romantic feelings... it just doesn't work. Even more conventional pairings like Remus/Tonks need a little more perspective than most young teens have. But when you get into the intricate dynamics of a relationship between Hermione and Severus... it's best if you've lived a bit more first.
And, a related pet peeve, younger writers who attempt to write graphic sex scenes. I find myself tilting my head to the side and wondering exactly how that is supposed to work... I'm not saying that sex ought to be ignored by them in their fictions, just that the details might should be glossed over until they've had a bit more experience with the technicalities of it all.... *runs away* |
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| Zia |
| Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 8:28 am |
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Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 19
Location: Den Haag
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| Why oh why need fans to make the WW into this extremely sexist copy of a Victorian society? I was reading a very pleasant fic, and suddenly I'm reading a story where hysbands are not only lord and master, but can use magic to make their wife obey... If you want to make a travesty of the WW, create your own where you can play with your submissive fantasies to your harts content. |
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| slytherinheiress |
| Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 10:05 pm |
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Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 11
Location: Middle of the Middle West, USA
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Zia wrote: Why oh why need fans to make the WW into this extremely sexist copy of a Victorian society?
Victorian society = sexist. I see clear parallels between the Pureblood society and Victorian society. That's the wonderful thing about fan-fic - we all get to expound on our own ideas and theories!
Kristin |
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| mouseII |
| Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 10:59 pm |
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Joined: 05 May 2005
Posts: 76
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I'm with Zia; this is something I've seen again and again in HP fanfiction, and I don't understand where it came from.
In canon, there are a lot of men in positions of authority, but there are also women there (McGonagall, Madame Bones). It's not that different from the Muggle world, in that respect. There are stay-at-home moms (Molly), but there are also women actively pursuing careers, even potentially dangerous ones (Tonks).
There is no indication that a husband is lord and master of his wife. Molly dominates Arthur, rather than the other way around; Narcissa worries about disobeying Voldemort, but doesn't appear to fuss much about Lucius' opinion; both Sirius' mother and Neville's grandmother were/are potent matriarchs - I doubt they were ever submissive to their husbands. I can't see Bellatrix being submissive to her husband either, for that matter.
Merope and her father are one example in canon where a man dominates a woman, but there aren't many others, and the fanfiction idea that the wizarding world is sexist predates Half-Blood Prince anyway. Merope's submissiveness could not have spawned this.
There is no really overt sexism in canon - Hermione is the smart one, and Ron and Harry admit that to her face. No one tells Hermione that girls don't take Arithmancy, or counsels her to hide her intelligence in order to impress boys. She is encouraged at every step of her education; the world is open to her. Also, girls in the wizarding world play Quidditch and join the dueling club. They do girly things also, but they aren't held back from any activity.
The wizarding world is vaguely backward compared to the Muggle world in terms of things like electricity and ball-point pens (which are arguably not compatible with magic), but it is not very sexist. Racist and otherwise imperfect, yes, but not sexist. |
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| slytherinheiress |
| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2005 3:10 am |
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Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 11
Location: Middle of the Middle West, USA
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mouseII wrote: The wizarding world is vaguely backward compared to the Muggle world in terms of things like electricity and ball-point pens (which are arguably not compatible with magic), but it is not very sexist. Racist and otherwise imperfect, yes, but not sexist.
It's a natural progression, I think. Jo doesn't expound on 'Pureblood society' - social customs, common practices, etc. - too terribly much, which leaves fan-fic enthusiasts to form their own ideas (again, the beauty of fan-fic).
The only 'canon Narcissa' that we really get a feel for doesn't have to worry too much about what her husband thinks - he's locked up, and she's trying to save the life of her son.
Again, just my humble opinion.
Kristin |
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| Zia |
| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2005 8:39 am |
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Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 19
Location: Den Haag
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It is not a natural progression at all. It is bad knowledge of canon combined with bad romance novels. We see countless portraits of headmistresses, we see that the immensely old head of the examining board is a woman. The founders of Hogwarts were two women and two men. If anything, the WW had sexual equality long before the muggle world. There is nothing victorian about the WW in mentality, only in gadgets.
I see fanfiction as a tribute to the author. She has made this wonderful world where we like to play in. And the least people can do is not make that world into a travesty, where husbands use enchantments to dominate their wives and other rubbish. Witches have wands too you know.
Zia |
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| liquidscissors |
| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2005 11:31 am |
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Joined: 27 Dec 2004
Posts: 164
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Quote: It is bad knowledge of canon combined with bad romance novels.
Oh, don't forget the Brit-bashing aspect of it as well. One simply can't write a story about British magical society without putting a few cheap shots in about the Motherland.
I'll just c&p a part of something I wrote about this and sent to a fic list where the whole 'man is the master and woman the servant, neo-Victorian Harlequin romance' mentality is rife. It was more to do with a particularly asinine discussion about contraception and abortion in the WW than the status of women, but it applies here as well.
Quote: Given that the WW has a very progressive attitude towards women - equal teachers, ministry portfolio leaders, governing seats and positions on justice panels - I find it highly unlikely that magical women would put up with anyone dictating what they can or cannot do with their own bodies, or who they can or cannot marry.
As if Hermione, McGonagall, Hooch or Tonks would put up with some lout forcing himself on her, or take it as a precursor to 'love'. If she didn't have a wand handy to magically castrate him (or the more low-tech version, stab him in the nadgers with it), they'd deliver a sharp kick with their witchy boots to the crown jewels, trash his wizarding records and hightail it out of there.
If fanfic was anything to go by, having both a wand and a uterus automatically knocks ninety points off your IQ. |
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| slytherinheiress |
| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2005 12:50 pm |
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Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 11
Location: Middle of the Middle West, USA
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Zia wrote: It is not a natural progression at all. It is bad knowledge of canon combined with bad romance novels. Zia
Now that is simply not fair. I was speaking of a very small part of wizarding society for which there is not much description in canon to support or refute a certain view. I'm not speaking of general wizarding society, and I'm not speaking of poorly written fluff drivel where men force themselves on women with little or no consequence and if you have both a wand and a uterus, your IQ drops by ninety points. Not at all. I simply suspect that, in polite society, pureblooded women are expected to "know their place" - I take the conspicuous lack of active, vocal female Death Eaters (save Bellatrix LeStrange) to be confirmation of sorts.
And it's simply an opinion - there's no need to get your knickers in a twist. I'm an intelligent, educated woman - I hold no illusions about the "romance" of a misogynistic society.
Kristin |
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